WILL UNWOUND #298: “Do Grade Point Averages Make a Difference in the Hiring Process?”
December 9, 2010Yesterday’s post, “Any Advice for an Aspiring Librarian?” generated tons of interesting comments and much very good advice.
There was one comment in particular which caught my eye. It was written by a Frightened MLS Student. There were so many comments yesterday that I’m afraid you may have missed it. It was comment #62 and I have reprinted it at the end of my post for your quick perusal. It is well written, touching, and a bit alarming all at the same time. It will make you feel good about the kids coming out of LIS school these days. Let’s just hope they can land jobs…especially “Frightened.”
The comment raises many good issues and expresses many valid feelings, but one small thing in the comment that struck me was that the “Frightened MLS Student” mentioned having a 4.0 grade point average in library school.
Here’s where you may want to take me out back of the Unwinder Tavern and beat the stuffings out of me with your aluminum baseball bats *swings baseball bats*. While I am very much pro diversity and anti biases and stereotypes, I am a flawed, very imperfect, and at times overly judgmental human being.
To wit: I have a nit to pick with straight A students. First, it’s okay if you got a 4.0 gpa. Some students can’t help it. They are that smart. But many straight A students can be insufferable about it. They see school as a grade factory rather than as an institution of learning. These are the kids who always ask “Is this material going to be on the test?” Personally, I always thought the stuff that wasn’t going to be on the test was more interesting than the stuff that was. But, again, that’s flawed little moi.
I actually felt sorry for students with a straight A complex. They tended to ignore friendships, sports, student government, and extracurricular activities to focus on their studies. To me C students had a certain flair and spirit of independence. C does stand for creativity, doesn’t it? Then again, George Bush was a C student.
Anyway, in the work place I found that straight A students were often deflated because other than the Mickey Mouse performance review forms that most supervisors are required to fill out, there is no on the job grade point average. In that regard straight A students were often validation deprived and could develop high maintenance self esteem issues. Don’t get me wrong…they were almost always excellent and very meticulous workers. It’s just that they needed to have this documented in some impractically permanent way.
Early on in my management career, however, I realized that I needed to understand straight A students a little better because it became immediately obvious to me that many librarians were straight A students. I needed to give them the benefit of the doubt. In my discovery process I found that straight A students often had stress put on them at home from an early age to be high achievers and to go to prestigious schools. So the challenge from a management standpoint was to somehow figure out a way to unwind that stress and help the person relax and enjoy the pleasures of library work. That’s when I began to understand the importance of introducing humor into the work place culture so that employees would learn not to take things so seriously. Yes, library work is important and we might be answering tons of medical reference questions but we aren’t doing prostate surgery in the staff sick bay.
Because I realized I harbored this secretive little bias against straight A students (and my guess is that the armchair psychologists among you are having a field day with this little neurosis of mine), very early on in my life as a library manager I made a decision never to inquire about a job applicant’s grade point average so as not to be biased against her/him.
But that didn’t solve the problem. Straight A students often had an annoying habit of mentioning their grade point average on their resumes. Why? I’m not sure. Obviously they thought it was important. As a result, I would have my admin assistant pre-screen the applications and redact any mention of gpa just to keep the playing field level.
That brings us to “Frightened’s” comment (re-printed below). I am so impressed with the creativity and out of the box point of view in this comment, that it has singlehandedly changed my mind about straight A students . They most definitely can rock with the best of the C students!
But that still begs the questions of the day for you Unwinders as you sip your virtual Chardonnays and savor your make believe martinis (who knows … maybe you’re drinking the real thing!):
· Do you factor undergraduate or library school gpa’s into your hiring decision.
· Do you think gpa’s are any kind of an indicator or predictor of on the job library performance?
· Do you think gpa’s are a good indicator of intelligence?
· Would you advise newbie job applicants to put their gpa’s on their resumes?
· Would you advise them not to put their gpa’s on their resumes?
· What advice would you give “Frightened”?
Here is the extraordinary comment from a Frightened MLS Student:
The pessimistic comments make me sick.
No, I mean, literally. I couldn’t finish reading the thread because I freaked out and almost had to go throw up! I am at this moment going into debt to obtain an MLS degree because working in a library is the ONLY thing that really makes me happy. I love everything about it. I worked in a public library for a year and have worked in an academic library for a few months now, but it is a student position that will end when I graduate. I work very hard at work and school. I have a 4.0 and am getting tons of experience. But I know that when I get out, I’ll probably wind up working a photo booth at Six Flags like a degreed friend of mine in TX to make ends meet while I lament the fact that there isn’t a job for me. Meanwhile my friends from my old library system say, “Don’t worry, you will get hired!” Yeah, easy for them to say. They’ve had their jobs 10+ years. They don’t know what it’s like trying to break into the profession right now.
Book Lover: Go shadow some librarians. Working in a library won’t necessarily give you an accurate idea of what a librarian does, since you’ll be a paraprofessional and most likely just shelving or doing circulation. Find some actual professionals, be they degreed or no, and see what they really do on a day-to-day basis. Also, find some MLS students and talk to them about how they feel school has really helped or not helped them. Find someone going through school NOW, not someone with fuzzy happy memories of younger days that look a lot brighter in hindsight.
Understand that your love of books means very little in library school. Turning people onto books is called “reader’s advisory,” and for most of us, it isn’t the major part of the job AT ALL. My college offers only one course in it. No, you learn about information, how to be a manager (in theory!), organization, public relations… If you want to get people interested in literature, I suggest you continue your education in literature and become a professor, because sure, you will be teaching people who don’t give a flying crap about Austen, Hemingway, or Salinger, but they represent the general public. You will at least have the ability to make an impression on them, a more lasting one than a short readers’ advisory interview would allow. Library isn’t so much about books now, anyway: the big draw in public library is movies and the public access computers.
I won’t say I haven’t learned anything in library school, but I will say I haven’t learned nearly as much in a year and a half as can be learned on a desk in six months. You get an almost purely theoretical education. When you ask, “How the eff is this going to help me out there?” (and oh, you WILL ask), you will hear “This is a professional degree, not a vocational degree.” Okay, why is that? How is it helpful?! Half the time I feel that the point of school is to turn me into an ALA drone. “Equal access to information!” Please. While I do believe in that concept, people aren’t coming to librarians for equal access to information. They think they’ve already got it through Google.
My library school education has been filled with instances of me being told how important technology is (without being taught how to use anything more complex than podcasting software), or being told that we aren’t in competition with technology because we’re the ones on the cutting edge of it. Um, REALLY? Then why is it that the librarians at my job don’t even know how to make a printer switch to single-sided, let alone make a website? Why is it that they have no interest in learning? And these, for the most part, are NOT older librarians.
In every class, I have had to address some form of the question, “In this digital age, how can libraries keep up and stay valid?” We are expected to answer with something along the lines of, “By using technology and marketing aggressively, and gosh darn it, being SWELL!” I have a current textbook that says we aren’t in competition with the internet, but with physical bookstores. Well, that’s good, because I just got done with a stint in that industry, and they’re fighting not to go out of business! Why? Because of ereaders and amazon.com. You know. THE INTERNET. So, anyhow, once they’re gone, we won’t have any competition, right? Because we aren’t competing with the internet, allegedly!
I like school. I like making good grades and getting a pat on the head for it. But I love libraries. Libraries are the love of my life, I work in or use them constantly, and what I see in real life and what I am told in school are not the same. Remember that many professors (the vast majority at my school) have not practiced in YEARS.
I’m certainly not alone in my feelings. I have voiced these opinions to many other students and have had others voice the same complaints. I know I sound like a bitter, petty little person for saying a lot of this, but I’m NOT bitter…I’m worried and desperate, because I don’t want to waste all this time and money and wind up NOT getting to work in a library.
So, Book Lover, if you feel like you’ll wither and die without libraries (like ridiculously dedicated me), get your MLS. Otherwise, go into teaching or look into joining the ebook craze somehow.
But about your parents? Make your own decisions if you fiscally can. Here’s another fun story: At 18, I wanted to get a degree in Library Science. My parents scared me out of it, telling me I’d starve to death. Had I ignored them, I’d have hit the job market when the economy was peaking and I would not be awake at 12:30 in the morning spilling my guts (kind of literally) to a bunch of complete strangers.
Love,
Terrified Librarian-to-Be
by A Frightened MLS Student December 8, 2010 at 6:33 am edit comment
I don’t usually care what their GPA is. I also happen to care less about standardized tests like the GRE, etc. Why you may ask?
1. Because grades are not a predictor of performance in the real world.
Frankly some people are test smart, but that’s all the smart there is, sad to say it but we’ve all seen it.
2. Because in the GRE/SAT/ACT etc literature it clearly and bluntly states (and here I paraphrase because I haven’t looked at one of the damn things in decades is: “The results of this examination should not be used to either admit or deny admission…”
3. GPA in Grad School is pretty much A or B and that’s it. Big whoop. You’ll either get nominated for Beta Phi Mu or you won’t. Often it has more to do with social skills than your GPA.
…and Dear Terrified;
As far as the freak out quotient goes – lol – try graduation w/ an MA in Humanities or Social Sciences and wondering about your job prospects.
Be confident, stay strong, be mobile and persistent and all WILL be well. Best, John B
John…thanks for your point of view. I always did better on standarized tests (sat and gre) than gpa.
Re: GPAs
No, no, a thousand times no. Do not mention it, Do not think it predicts anything. Do not expect that it predicts anything but an iron butt — and the iron butt only comes into play later in the career when no one would dream of asking about a GPA.
I was frankly mediocre as a student except in courses that interested me. (The rule of thumb was if a course excited me, I got an A. If it was meh, I probably got a B unless it was a language course, then any grade was pure charity. Other classes were Cs. Things got a little better in my senior year after appearing on College Bowl. The halo effect is a wonderful thing. By the time I was done, I had a 3.0 — the same as I had in high school.) I was in a very small liberal arts college (>600 students), so we all had a pretty good idea of who had wheels and who didn’t. Half of the PBKs were truly bright. The other half worked really hard.
I value “bright” a lot more than I value “works really hard”. I like the folks that I hire or promote to have growth potential. The hardest worker can’t add another four hours to the day.
Bill, I’m in agreeance. Thanks for the validation. btw…jack morris for the HOF!
Only if Dewey Evans gets in too! (But I think both are moves to the Hall of the Very Very Good)
Bill, no one gets into the Library Hall of Fame until Bill Ott does. That’s Bill Ott, not Mel Ott!
Oh, that’s a tough one. Even though I didn’t mention him in the first iteration (Mea culpa; mea maxima culpa!) Sandy Berman had to be the first inductee. In the writers’ wing, he’d be close to the first entry (but Berry and Plotnik are arguable — not to mention Eli Oboler — for precedence). My bias really runs to the practitioners like Berman, Allie Beth Martin and EJ Josie. And the educators are a whole nother thing.
Bill, Bill Ott totally transformed Booklist into a literate publication. Bill Ott is that obscure guy who has put library science into the same level as the New York Times Book Review. Bill Ott needs some recognition. Bill Ott is the little known Library Guy!
Murble, murble, murble. Further reflection required. I’d say that Plotnik raised not one but two library publications from the dead. And Berry gets the Tommy John (Burt Blyleven) career value vote.
Bill, I’m into total agreeance about Berry and Ploknik. No argument there. But Bill Ott is the guy who no one really knows who has worked absolute wonders with an ALA publication. He needs to be in the Hall.
Remember that since we located the HOF at the Billy Goat, we toast each inductee with the brew of our choice. In case that has any influence on how selective we choose to be.
RA… Bill Ott will feel very at home at Billygoats. The man is at home with a copy of Moby Dick as with the latest pale ale.
In that case, RA, the more the merrier! (My favorite winter brew at the moment is KLB (Kawartha Lakes Brewing) Nut Brown Ale (The Beer that Made Peterborough Famous). Summer means moving from English style to German style — probably Grolsch.
Dewey Evans in the HOF? That would be sweet. What a joy to watch in right field. Too much emphasis on batting by the voters, not enough attention paid to his glove skills.
I’ll drink a virtual Sam Adams to that!
Is M. R. James in the HOF? He’s my favorite librarian, along with Borges.
Candidate M.R. James, heartily seconded. I lift a glass in his honor and nod courteously at the enigmatic shape that seems to be crouching behind the rood screen.
Bill Ott is the Jack Morris of Library Science!
I have to blush and finally agree. (How badly had Ott been under-rated? I’ve been wondering why you’re so passionate about him. Then I figured out that I was looking at Bill Katz’ ‘numbers’. Wrong guy. Sigh.
By the way, any chance that for the purposes of our Hall the Boston rightfielder could be entered as Dui Evans?
Leslie…I totally agree with you about Dewey Evans. But how about B. Ott?
For Booklist alone, he gets in on the first ballot!
Your comments reflect my experience exactly. And I also attended a small college — Trinity in Deerfield, IL. Getting A’s in Library school was relatively easy, however. I had one B when I dared disagree with a professor.
Hmm, which do I value more “bright” vs. “works really hard.” It’s not an obvious choice for me. On days where things are crazy, and there are lots of deadlines to meet, I’ll take “works really hard.” When we have to rethink the way we run our whole operation, I’ll go for “bright.” If I could get both in a person, that would be great! These days, I personally seem to be pulling up short on both qualities, so I’ll take either.
This isn’t something I’ve thought much about, I always put my gpa on my vita, but then it’s a vita not a resume and I mostly apply for academic positions.
I admit to being rather proud of my string 3.7′s for all my degrees – for me that means that I took school seriously but no so much that I failed to do anything else for years on end.
Jessica…thanks for the clarification. What’s the diff between a resume and a vita?
A vita is for an academic position and is much longer. Mine currently runs around 13 pages and includes education (always at the top in a vita), teaching experience, librarian work, peer reviewed paper and books, professional writing and presentations, book reviews, websites, grants, and lastly professional activities.
Lots more detail than a resume – for example of my job descriptions comes with 3 bullets saying what I actually did. In some ways it is a complete academic history, all neatly organized. I keep mine on my website, which is mostly an enhanced version of my vita (with links), here, jessicaemilymoyer.pbworks.com
I don’t know if I’ve even known most of our applicants’ GPAs! Yes, I think in a very general way GPA can correlate with intelligence (well, maybe in one direction–I don’t think a dumb person could get a high GPA at a decent school, but I’ve known a lot of very bright people whose grades weren’t so great). But I’ve been interviewing people since the days when we were chaining parchment codices to our shelves, and I think I’ll get a pretty good sense of how smart someone is from a combination of their résumé, their letter of application, and an hour’s conversation with them.
By the way, I was not nominated for Beta Phi Mu. *wipes tear*
Don’t cry too hard over Beta Phi Mu, R.A. The only communication I ever get from them is an email every couple of years saying “we’re updating our contact list so we can communicate better with our members” and then I confirm my contact info and never hear anything again until they update the list again 2 years later. The emails I have sent to them inquiring about things have gone unanswered. Maybe I just missed the secret handshake, or something…
Thanks, Genesis, I appreciate that observation!
Oh, and my advice would be not to put the GPA on your résumé. Even if it’s stellar, I don’t think it looks right. Now if you’re in Beta Phi Mu (unlike me (*sob*)), put that in, as Genesis says below.
RA…I’ll take the 1 hour conversation any time!
Okay – here are my reactions to the questions you posed.
SK: The grammar police would take issue with your use of the apostrophe to indicate the plural of gpa.
· Do you factor undergraduate or library school gpas into your hiring decision.
SK: Actually, since I don’t hire, that’s not an issue.
· Do you think gpas are any kind of an indicator or predictor of on the job library performance?
SK: No. Some people do well on tests; others don’t. Some people do research and write papers well; others don’t.
The Large Public Library for which I used to work relied strictly on tests when considering people for promotion. If a person didn’t test well, they didn’t make the final cut, aka the eligible list.
· Do you think gpas are a good indicator of intelligence?
SK: Absolutely not. I consider myself intelligent (and am so considered by others) but I’d never set the world on fire based on my grade point.
· Would you advise newbie job applicants to put their gpas on their resumes?
SK:No.
· Would you advise them not to put their gpas on their resumes?
SK: Yes. It’s irrelevant to the job.
· What advice would you give “Frightened”?
SK: Be creative in your job search. The skills you have acquired in library school, particularly reference and yes, cataloging, are very portable.
Good luck!
Sue…Huzzah. I wondered about the appropriateness of the apostrophe. Thanks.
Just to clarify: My 4.0 is there because I realized something about library school very quickly, which is that it is not hard. You can get As with a minimum of effort. Therefore, if I don’t make As, what does that say? Also, I feel like if I’m going to have to pay for this education, I need to squeeze everything possible from it. I stay on top of my assignments aggressively and turn in my best work only. If there is extra credit, I do it, whether I need it or not. I don’t do it for the grade, necessarily, but to make sure I’m taking advantage of the learning opportunities that come my way. I told a friend once that library school is like writing a blog: You start out with a basic framework, and you can be creative and make something meaningful from it, or you can just coast along and do what everyone else does and never get noticed.
I came into school determined to come out the other side as polished and hire-able as I can be. To me, that means getting experience while I’m in school, observing in libraries and really thinking about the issues that face them as well as day-to-day life, volunteering, doing independent projects, and mostly, looking ahead to the future… Anything I can do that will help me get a job, make me able to be a help and credit to any system that takes me on, and put me in a position to do what I can to benefit our patrons and profession. Don’t get me wrong, I have my own hobbies, friends, interests, and creative projects outside Libraryland, but Libraryland is where my heart really is.
That sounds corny, but I’m okay with that.
Frightened…you’re okay, I’m not okay, and hey, that’s okay. Hang in there. You are a good writer. To me that’s all there is!
I think it is great that you know yourself well enough to know you love working in Libraryland and who cares if that sounds corny – I love working in Libraryland too and I love assisting patrons and helping them discover new things whether it is which new book they would enjoy reading, to where to find books on how to grow holly bushes, to where to find books for that school project to how to create a resume with Word, how to set up an email account, where to find tax forms….I love it and am still idealistic enough to believe that it is important to help people —corny or not!
I, too, was one of those ‘high gpas’, and though I didn’t include it on my resume, I did mention it in my cover letter. Why? Because I thought it would speak to my work ethic. I worked full time while going to grad school full time, and I was darned proud of it! But I also agree that library school wasn’t the most difficult thing I could have done. I just kicked myself in the butt that I didn’t do it 20 years earlier so that I could be doing the job I was meant to be doing all my life.
By the way, I was also tapped for Beta Phi Mu. I didn’t think it would necessarily help me to get my current position (in a public library), but I saw it as icing on the cake I’d been baking for the previous 2 years!
I don’t recommend putting your GPA on your resume. It’s not something I look for when I’m on a hiring panel, and it almost always looks like resume padding, i.e. “I don’t have enough experience, so I’m going to throw my GPA on there just to add an extra line.” If you’re in Beta Phi Mu, list it in your professional associations. Otherwise, the fact that you got a Master’s Degree tells me what I need to know about your education. I’m MUCH more concerned with your answers in the interview and the enthusiasm you project.
If you want to make sure your resume helps you get the interview in the first place, tailor your resume to the job flyer. Don’t make the committee guess if your experience is relevant – make it clear by echoing the language of the job flyer in your resume. This is especially important if your job experience is outside the library field. Don’t make people work to figure out if you’re qualified. Sure, go ahead and have a generic resume for posting on job websites, but any time you apply for a specific position, revise your resume accordingly. Hint: the more up-to-date your resume is, the less work this will be. Minor tweaks will suffice for most jobs.
I have no idea if GPA is reflected in job performance, since I don’t know the GPAs of any of the people I work with. I certainly don’t think they’re an accurate predictor of intelligence. Work ethic, MAYBE, but not intelligence.
Genesis…as always – great advice! You’ve been there.
Don’t give a darn about GPA – doesn’t really tell me anything. I’ve known some PhD’s who were idiots when it came to real life, though I guess that’s talking about a degree rather than a GPA. I learned early I could game the system – if you get a reputation for being smart, the A comes easy.
Will, I also am made crazy by people who only care to know “what’s on the test”. What a narrow view of education. What’s not on the test could be far more important later on. Facts are not wisdom.
I have gotten job interviews because of where I went to college (Ivy League – yes, you may kiss my ring – LOL) and because I’m supposedly “wicked smaht” as they say here in the northeast. After each interview, I knew I would never want to work in such a snobby place. So there you go.
Like Bill above, I value “bright” – intelligent, interested, curious, engaged people. Some people with impressive GPAs are bright, but it’s no indicator that’s so, and I wouldn’t use it to put someone’s resume in the “interview” pile.
I don’t think there is any “magic bullet” to get an interview out of a resume – those of us who hire all have our own little quirks and choose accordingly. Life is funny that way.
Leslie…as always thanks for this. You make me feel not so dumb.
If you’re dumb, I’m the Queen of all the Russias. Wicked smaht is what I’m thinkin’.
In my experience on both sides of the hiring process, grade point never came up. The important factor was, “What school did you attend?” I lost points for my school because so many librarians had gone there. It was very similar to a diversity issue. Today that school, since totally transformed, is very prestigious and its placement statistics prove that well enough. They are plugged in to the business community. It’s about contacts, about who you know, and they are savvy to this reality. In my day it was a bit stodgy.
I know of libraries who will not hire anyone from San Jose State. People who have come from there can fuss and fume all they want at the “unfairness” of it all, but the fact is, if that’s on your resume, it goes to the bottom of the pile. Why? Because it’s considered a diploma mill. (All parents know the word “unfair” means ‘I don’t agree.’)
My conclusion is that the school you attend is vastly more important than your GPA. You should never attend a school simply because it is convenient for you. I’ve heard that here: “It’s the only school in my area!” Well, then, move! If you’re treating your school selection like a local grocery store, why should I hire you again? Your selection of a school deserves your particular scrutiny and attention.
To Scared, yup. I can see why you are.
Mick, thanks for giving me an insight into my next post. You rock!
Mick, my experience on both sides of the hiring process has been totally different – school attended didn’t matter much more than GPA did, as long as it was accredited. I didn’t have any trouble getting interviews or landing a job after graduation, in spite of my San Jose State degree.
Genesis…good point. It’s not the school; it’s the person!
I graduated libschool with a 3.8. In undergrad, I had a 4.0 in my eight creative writing classes (that was my major), but that doesn’t reflect my three A+s.
Hate me yet, Will?
All that said, GPAs and test scores are stupid. They certainly don’t tell you anything about the kind of employee that the candidate will become. And as Frightened pointed out, anyone with a pulse and a means of respiration, even if both are electronically generated, can ace library school. Another of its many elephants in the room. :p
Jessa, I was worried…*she swings the aluminum baseball bat.* Very relieved. wheeew!
LOL, no, Will, I don’t have an itchy bat hand. There are some people who take grades very, very seriously. If you find them insufferable, then you find them insufferable. :p
I’ma save my bat reaches for times when I sincerely believe that there is a gulf between your intentions (in the nearly-a-year that I have known you, always good) and the impact of the words you chose to express them. Your written “self” deserves to be as awesome as you are. <3
Wheew!
Jessa, a comment about use of language. I don’t want people guarding their speech or writing, because when they do, they hide their true natures from me. When people write, I want them to let it all hang out, so that I can truly know who they are.
In the old Catholic Church in which I was raised, nothing could be published under Church auspices without a pass from the official censor. Works that passed were printed with a small notation on the verso: “Nihil obstat,” followed by the name of the censor. It means “nothing offends.” How ghastly. Let us instead offend! By all means let us offend!
Your calling me or Will on the carpet for our characterizations is more than fine. Makes us question our assumptions. Though I will scarcely presume to speak for Will, we were both kids in the era in which the default condition was White Male = God’s Gift. Hard to get over that. And some days you wonder how the heck the world flipped you from Top Dog to Oppressor. You were a nice Top Dog, after all, and you certainly didn’t think you were oppressing anybody.
Go easy on the language thing. Let people express themselves with the chips falling as they may. Much more interesting — and revealing — that way. Words do have an impact. Let ‘em make it.
Sounds good to me, Joe. I’m all for people questioning assumptions (myself included); I’m not for silencing. Among other reasons, I like the ones you mention about getting to know someone’s true opinions through their language. Thank you.
One more thing… *he braces himself* Your appointing yourself the guardian and monitor of Will’s intentions and their expression is a bit, well, uh… *he declines to pick an adjective because he really, really likes Jessa*
Ah, egad! Now you’ve thanked me in the nicest way, and I’ve piled on!
So sorry.
LOL, no worries. I know calling people out for word choices can come off badly, and I know that *I* can come off as obnoxious and self-righteous for doing it. I’ve long since owned that and made peace with it.
In the past, I’ve relied on Will’s status as a Big Tall Grown-Up (TM) to act as a foil to anything I say. I wrote with confidence that Will could read my comment, decide that he thought it was crap, and summarily ignore it; as is right and fitting, I have no power whatsoever to make anyone here change anything they say, least of all Will as it’s his blog. But for the reasons you mentioned, it can be best for me to not comment in the first place.
Jessa…just be yourself! You are rare.
By that I mean that you are the real deal!
*blush* Thank you, Will.
Ditto Will’s remarks.
Do blogs have spinoffs, like great sitcoms? I even have a name for yours, Ms. J. — Jessa Wound Up. Those of us in the Will Unwound supporting cast could make guest appearances on your show.
My growing-up sitcoms were in black and white. Yes, I watched Leave It to Beaver in its original run. Long before The Office, Eddie Haskell became an archetype for a certain type of person we all know from the workplace.
Just out of curiosity — are there people in this forum who, when I say “Cheers!,” would either raise their glass or say “that was on before I was born”?
Were I a member of the Cheers supporting cast instead of the WUW cast, I would be Cliff Clavin.
But, heck, all librarians would be Cliff Clavin.
Omigod, I remember Cheers. Speaking of spinoffs, Frasier is possibly my favorite television show of all time. (And yes, I would totally be a Frasier if we Unwinders magically became the Cheers cast. Every group of friends needs its pompous, interfering, too-smart-for-their-own-fool-good windbag. *grins and feels totally okay about her numerous shortcomings, if for no other reason than because they are entertaining*)
“Jessa Wound Up” is freakin’ hilarious, Joe. I don’t know that I could write content that would live up to it. Hmm…
Was Eddie Haskell a Dwight Schrute before there was a Dwight Schrute?
Not exactly. Eddie Haskell was a sneaky, weaselly little shit around his peers, but around adults became an obsequious toady.
The Wikipedists, in this case, sum the character up pretty well:
“The character, played in the original series by Ken Osmond, has become a cultural reference, recognized as an archetype for insincere sycophants. Ward Cleaver once remarked that ‘[Eddie] is so polite, it’s almost un-American.’ ”
Read the complete Wikipedia entry. It’s good stuff. If you had a college classmate who dissed a prof when he was having a beer with you, but toadied up to the prof when he was in the classroom, you had an Eddie Haskell on your hands.
Hey! Cheers wasn’t that long ago. I’d probably be Carla, though at 5’4″ I’m too tall. Just for memories sake, who remembers Spin and Marty?????
Um … Cheers was after my time. (After we basically stopped watching much TV, more precisely.) It became one of the vast parade of cultural references I have little or no clue about. Leave It to Beaver I remember well, and I may have seen an episode or two of Spin and Marty–never got into it, though.
Maybe you younger Unwinders can help me out here. I’ve heard a rumor that the moving pictures are starting to come out with the sound right on the film somehow, talking and music and everything. True? That would put a lot of piano players out of business. *shakes grizzled head*
In my previous career as an executive recruiter, we would rework all resumes into the house style: no where was GPA mentioned. It does. not. matter. to anyone except the recipient (ditto your love of knitting and fears that your ex-pat born children don’t like PB&G, but I digress).
To get an interview, craft cover letters that match your experience/professional interests/strengths to those of the employer’s position description and have several resumes geared to different things (eg, one that’s great for reference skills, another that touts your mad skillz at gaming). And network network network (which is where the old school tie comes in, but it’s only an aid, nothing more).
Laura…you always give very good real time advice.
*blush*
Looking back 25+ years – most of the courses in library school were theory-based and theory only goes so far in the real world. One of my biggest complaints about the instructors? Very few had actually spent real time in the library world. Since I was working full-time in a library I took an awful lot of their ideas with a hefty pinch o’ salt. The nuts and bolts classes (reference, cataloging and automation) were far more relevant.
Maybe things have changed and more LIS instructors have been actual practitioners but I find I’ve not been too terribly impressed by the 4.0 MLIS candidates. Too much theory, not enough real world experience.
Ellen…good point. Nothing against a 4.0 but really what does it matter in the real world. Thanks.
I graduated in 1998, and the only useful classes were taught by adjuncts – because they actually worked in the real world. It really is a technical degree, and should include an internship as a requirement for graduation.
As a former adjunct, I thank you.
Ditto, Leslie. Same year. Same experience.
Leslie…that’s a very important point that I neglected to bring up.
I do think an internship or practicum should be required for all LIS degrees. While it was optional in my program I still did one even though I also worked as a reference assistant. It was great because it exposed me to new areas and ideas.
I also supervised practicum students and found that to be one of the most rewarding experiences as a librarian. I would encourage any one working in a library to make their workplace a volunteer/internship/practicum opportunity. Even if you aren’t near a school, there are probably distance students near you that could use a place to volunteer.
At the moment I’m glad I missed that 4.0 with my last degree — I had A’s from all but one professor and doubt I’ll do quite as well, GPA wise, at the graduate degree level because I am tired and a bit put out so far by, as someone else noted during yesterday’s discussion thread, all the emphasis in the MLIS classes on the information technology side of the equation and not enough emphasis on items that focus on really dealing with patrons in a public/academic library setting. And interestingly enough Drexel just changed the degree program this year to an MLIS program instead of the former MLS program which highlights the fact that the library field is changing but then that’s another subject and a whole other conversation.
But really, a GPA can indicate to a degree how hard one works and how intelligent one is but only to a degree. Because it doesn’t really show how a person will work in a library, or any job setting, until they get there – someone can be very bright and have a solid 4.0 GPA and then feel that certain responsibilities in a working place are beneath them and not be a team player or of course someone can have a 4.0 GPA and be an outstanding worker.
But I wouldn’t recommend that anyone hire a worker based solely on his or her GPA; because I think that experience, work ethic, enthusiasm for the work and the willingness to pitch in and help out and not think any task is beneath you…I think those are all more important attributes that whether or not someone had a 4.0 GPA in college.
Linda…very well articulated. Maybe you should have written my post.
Please, please, please, no GPA on your resume. Not for your graduate degree, not for your undergraduate. Do not list being president of the anime club during your undergraduate years as “relevant experience.” Don’t put “cum laud” after your degree and then add (with honors) – Like I don’t know what cum laud means, because then I’m just twice as annoyed.
DO get volunteer experience, but pick the best library around to volunteer in. If you pick an anti-technology, no programming kind of dusty library, I won’t care that you had the pluck to volunteer. Go sell yourself as a volunteer to a great library and make yourself indispensable. A librarian that fits that description has moved from volunteer to student clerk at our library, and is about to move into a real professional job.
I don’t know what her GPA was. I don’t care.
Frightened: Learn every technical skill you can, and learn it well. Take extra classes in those subjects. But don’t put a technical skill on your resume under “proficiencies” unless you truly are proficient. Library school is often about 10 years behind the curve. It was when I was there. It did not prepare me for the rapid pace of a successful, modern library. That’s why I recommend finding a way to connect yourself with a great library in some way. Work on your interview skills and work on your confidence (which you don’t seem to be lacking). You can do it!
Frontline: great advice, as always. Me…thank God I’m retired because I’m at least 30 years behind the times. Talk about dusty…that’s me!
Best library around: This is one reason I recommended a bricks and mortar degree for a woman I believe will be a fantastic librarian. She’ll be attending my alma mater and I recommended she get hired by UT’s General Libraries. She will be gold … unlike the woman I advised with a 4.0, an MLIS from an online university, zero library experience and no willingness to move out of town. Wouldn’t hire her on a bet.
No one has brought it up yet: A high GPA isn’t what it used to be because of grade inflation. Fifty percent of all grades handed out in college are an A. The bell curve has long, long since ceased to function in academia. The college A has been cheapened. You’d almost have to *work* at it to have a C average.
Since so many now have high GPAs, the GPA is essentially meaningless other than as a measure of the fact that you showed up and did the work. (Not that a measure of showing up and doing the work is to be taken lightly these days.)
I started working at age 16 and retired at age 60. No one ever once asked me about my grades.
My point exactly! Thanks, Joe!
My very first grad school class (Collection Development) began with these words: “If you show up to class, you will get an A.” My disillusionment began then.
Frontline…as a “c” student this depresses me.
No, no, no, Will. I had a prof do the same thing. It was WONDERFUL because what it allowed us to do was let go of the mindset “what do I need to get an A?” and open our minds to true learning. This particular class was a seminar, and it was fantastic because no one– including the professor–knew where the next class would take us.
Thanks, Elizabeth.
In my intro to library management class, we were told that we should not put GPAs on our resumes/CVs UNLESS we had just graduated, in which case we should definitely do so.
See, this is another reason library school makes me crazy. I don’t know when to believe the professors and when to throw the information out.
Perhaps she meant that those people who were graduating with no library experience should put their GPA on their resume to show that they, like most well-trained border collies, were able to succeed in library school.
Frightened…don’t lose your nerve. Me…I have baggage about straight A students. Freud would have a field day with me. Doesn’t mean others wouldn’t be duly impressed. To me creativity and expression are everything. Believe me, I’ve been around the block. You’ve got talent. You’ll be fine. Life takes time. In many ways life sucks but as Woody Allen said…”reality sucks but it’s the only place I know where you can get a steak.” Me…I love a good steak…medium rare.
My first boss (not a music job) once said, “I don’t care about grades. I do care that someone graduated because that shows a commitment and a strong work ethic.”
Never put my GPA on a resume, and no one ever asked. Would think if an interviewer was really interested, s/he would ask. I’m of the cut of cloth that an interview is as much for the interviewee (that doesn’t look right) as for the interviewer, so I have to supress the urge to ask what their GPA was.
My first job out of college was in a computer center. I had a degree in accounting. My boss said, during the interview, that the company didn’t care what my degree was in, just that I had a degree, which proved that I had the determination to make a committment and stick to it, and had the ability to learn.
Elizabeth and Deb…thanks for sharing this. I never looked at a degree in that light before.
Yes, some employers do want to know GPA, especially for young hires, but if they want to know they will ask. (Which reminds me of a job my husband applied for at an economics consulting firm. He has a very common name, and his alma mater sent the firm a transcript of someone else with the same name who was a phys ed major – not what the firm was looking for! Luckily, the firm questioned this and got the correct one. Which is a long way of saying that if a potential employer asks for academic credentials from your school, make sure to follow up with the school and make sure they did it right!)
Oops, don’t know what happened…that should have replied to you, Frightened.
Elizabeth,
I can see that professor’s point about just graduating. I had several very bright, very talented friends who did wonderfully their first semester, and then just walked away. They decided library school wasn’t what they thought it would be (too much theory) and that becoming a librarian wasn’t worth putting up with it.
And, on the flip side, I must admit that I know two people who actually washed out of library school. One of them…well, it wasn’t a surprise, is all I will say. The other had a law degree already, but she couldn’t seem to get herself organized and pass her classes. I think she just expected it to be so easy after law school that she could just sit there and the As would happen.
So yeah, I guess just surviving the grind says something about a person!
Grades are important to an extent, but it’s the comprehension that is crucial. There’s no point rattling off facts, figures, and theories if one doesn’t know how to apply said knowledge.
When people ask me to define education, my reply is always, “Learning how to learn.”
I was a straight A student until Calculus in high school. Got a B. I was so concerned about learning it and getting an A, I took it in college, had two tutors, and got an A. Did I need that level of math: nope. However, I’m not normal. You see, through most of my school I thought someone would discover that I was a fraud. That being of my particular class, race, and gender, I wasn’t good enough, and I constantly had a little voice telling me that if I did not do well, “they” would know, come find me, and banish me from the kingdom.
So I would read the required reading, the suggested reading, the readings mentioned in the footnotes to be on top of everything (not to mention that I’m one of those curious people that has to find out everything and squirrel it away for that late night trivia game over the holidays).
I still have that fear, but it is not about grades, it’s about my work. What I’ve discovered is that I don’t think anyone cares (but the scholarship or fellowship committee) what your GPA is when you apply for a job. Think about it, depending on what classes you take, what classes you liked, what classes were difficult your grades are going to vary. What is important is what you know and how you express that on your resume.
My employers are more interested in how “library ready” you are. Can you learn quick? What databases and systems are you familiar with? How many departments have you worked with? Are you familiar with web 2.0? What do you know about digital libraries? etc. This is the good stuff. GPA just signifies you can do required task according to someone’s guidelines, in a timely fashion.
A.E….I love your story about calculus. Good for you. Maybe the calculus did you more good than you realize. I was never good at math but I am glad that I was required to take calculus in college because it forced me to use a part of my brain that otherwise I would have allowed to get lazy. I think college should be all about challenging yourself to get out of your intellectual comfort zone, learn new things, and think in new ways. In that sense I really like your calculus story. Also I tend to agree with you about what employers are looking for. You’ve given me an idea for a new post for next week. Thanks, A.E.
I’ll repeat my plea from an earlier post: We ought to offer a second path to professional librarianship — you can “apprentice” in a library, do directed reading under a mentor, then sit for a professional licensure exam. No MLS — nor its expense and irrelevancy — required.
Joe, I heartily agree that there should be an alternate career path (along with a significant retooling of existing MLS programs).
The reason students think that the GPA is important is because that is what they’ve been told by the schools – and at this point, that is the only thing they know. The schools help them prepare their resumes, prepare them for job interviews, and tell them what is important to emphasize. And since schools can’t see past GPA and test scores, and the academic world has no clue about life in the real world, they give these kids false expectations. So, these kids are pushed to get the 4.0 GPA and to be proud of it. The schools shower them with awards, and it earns membership in “prestigious organizations”, “Who’s Who lists”, etc. So naturally they think it means something in the outside world. After all, would their school counselers, professors, and administrators lie to them? (please read that last with sarcasm.) It’s not just library school – it’s all fields, as far as I can tell. It certainly was for the undergraduate degree, and my daughter’s.
Part of the reason that professors are rarely practitioners any more is because of University administration. While I was in library school, library school was forced by the University administration to fire everyone who didn’t have a Ph.D. The University claimed it was for accreditation. That was not true. I actually wrote to the accrediting organization, and their vice president, who was an MLS, told me that they did not require Ph.D.s for library schools. However, the University hired a consultant who recommended that they get rid of the MLS’s, and the University took the consultant’s advice.
The other thing is, they have little or no work experience, so they try to make up for that lack by emphasizing that they have the stamina, determination, and academic ability to get the 4.0 in their chosen profession.
I have never, in 40 years of work in a variety of fields, ever been asked what my GPA was. I did have a 4.0 in library school, by the way. 15 years of working in a library was the primary reason for that. Also, it had been over 20 years since my undergrad degree so I was out to prove that I wasn’t over the hill and could still do it.
The library field, in this respect is no different that most others. There are more people graduating than there are jobs. The churn out so many MBAs that you could pave a California freeway with their degrees. They encourage kids to get degrees in computer science even though most end up as techs. Think about the number of degrees they turn out in Theater, communicatons, English literature, fine arts, etc. Really, where are those people working? I know electrical engineers running pizza restaurants, and check cashing stores.
I have said on more than one occasion that the University system is broken. It has long since become more about making money than about providing education. Until it is fixed, it will continue to send children like our frightened MLS student out into the world, deeply in debt and with no clue.
Deb…would it sound cynical if I gave your comment a grade of A+? Well…I’m being sincere. Thank you for thinking this issue through and articulating it so clearly. I had always thought that the pressure to get straight A’s came from within the individual or the family, but what you say make a great deal of sense. The schools bear much of the blame for creating that kind of a reward system. Thanks as always for a thought provoking comment. You get a shoutout!
I wouldn’t put my GPA on my resume, but I was asked for a copy of my transcript when I was hired for my first professional job. They were checking to see if the information I’d given was correct and that I qualified for state certification. The director who hired me indicated several years later that I was hired over someone who had all A’s because he felt that they had come too easily to her. He was glad to see some B’s, because it showed, in his opinion, that I knew what it meant to work for something. He was afraid that someone with all A’s may not know how to handle disappointment when they didn’t get everything they wanted.
However, we do look at GPAs when hiring high school students as pages. However, again we are not concerned with all A’s, but we don’t want to hire a kid who is having problems in school and should be concentrating on improving poor grades rather than a job.
No one cares about your GPA once you have your first job. They care about the degree, your work ethic, and the abilities you bring to the job. To see a 4.0 GPA on a resume wouldn’t necessarily impress me over someone with a 3.0 or 3.5.
Margaret, I wish every newbie would internalize your statement…”No one cares about your GPA once you have your first job.”
First let me state my bona fides: I graduated fourth from the bottom in my very large high school graduating class — after failing the year before. I am not a high GPA kinda guy (although I did much better in college). Nevertheless, I credit high GPA students with intelligence and resourcefulness, at least. You can’t get a 4.0 if you’re stupid and lazy.
I might use GPA a tie breaker if I were choosing between two otherwise comparable candidates. Thing is, I might decide to pick the one with the lower GPA.
For instance, if the high GPA candidate came across as a stuffed shirt, while the lower GPA candidate were more down to earth, I would choose the dummy. On the other hand, if both struck me as great people, I’d opt for the higher GPA student simply because it’s considered an objective, documentable criterion.
I of course agree with the posters who note that low or mediocre GPA is not an indicator of intelligence or performance. (how can I not?) But a very low GPA does raise a red flag. Given my experience I’m always ready to listen to a candidate’s explanation of a less than stellar GPA; keeping in mind the worlds of the preacher:
I returned, and saw under the sun, that the race is not to the swift, nor the battle to the strong, neither yet bread to the wise, nor yet riches to men of understanding, nor yet favour to men of skill; but time and chance happeneth to them all.
Charming Billy…you make a good deal of sense here. A low GPA does raise a red flag. Was it because the student was a party animal or was it because the student took all kinds of academic risks by challenging him/herself with tough courses out of one’s comfort zone? If it was the latter reason I would favor that applicant over the straight A student who took no academic risks. Libraries need a lot more risk takers.
There are more important things to put on a resume than a GPA, and I agree that it may be viewed as a turn-off by some, so leaving it off is probably best.
By the time I get done screening, interviewing, and checking references, I will know if the candidate is a good reader’s advisor, creative, technology-savvy, etc., and the GPA is pretty much irrelevant.
Wayne your comment gives me food for thought. I think I will do a future post on what you should emphasize on your resume.
I wouldn’t even think of putting GPA on my resume. Maybe it indicates that you can concentrate and remember things…but so can most B students. If an employer want’s to know, they can request copies of your transcripts with your application. Many do these days since wise employers verify your degree.
Of course, my opinion may be colored by the fact that I was one of those good, but not quite good enough students – National Merit Commended Student, not a Scholar, alternate for a Regents Scholarship, not the scholarship winner. I missed graduating undergrad with honors by .1 of a grade point – for which I blame taking a level three course on Marx and Marxism for my sophomore interim class. I had a crush on a senior history major.
Most people who want to be librarians are smart. GPA is just one indicator of smart, and smart is just one aspect of what you look for in an employee. Frankly, I would find it a turnoff on a resume, mainly because it conjures up shades of Ms. “I went to Berkeley, I’m as good as any MLS librarian”.
Mary Ellen…you make an excellent point that newbies need to internalize. If a prospective employer wants to know your GPA…he can ask for it. In my 35 year management career, however, I never once was interested in a GPA. Academically, what did interest me was what courses the applicant took and were they relevant to the job opening.
What do you call the person who graduated last in his/her medical class? Doctor
Gpas are good for the ego, not necessary for the workplace. As someone (Will?) mentioned earlier, once you’re in the workplace, you won’t be getting standardized grades again. This is where your real work skills are needed.
Vicki…so many young employees are deflated because there is no on the job SAT score, GRE score, or GPA. Their whole sense of self esteem has been fashioned by these sets of numbers during their scholastic years. It’s a shame really.
Years ago when I got my teaching certificate, I was told that my grade point mattered and that it would keep me from getting a teaching job. Dean’s list is good in college, but most principals who do the hiring will not hire anyone with a grade point higher than their own. (Don’t think about this too hard or it will scare the life out of you as you think about our education system) Never did get that job. Had kids, worked many places then got a part time parapro job at a library, from their to library school as a very old student (I think we should get a handicap on some of those fact type tests) and now am full time. My GPA didn’t matter at all when I was hired. I got the job several months before I finished my degree with a rider that I would finish it.
Beth…that is a fascinating statement: “most principals who do the hiring will not hire anyone with a GPA higher than their own.” Ouch.
3.6 Here. I think I have the lowest score so far. I did not know what it was, I had to look it up. However, I think I should get an extra point or 2 for being able to lay hands so quickly on my yellowing transcript
*Stands and stretches and heads off to pick up waking grand-bebe*
P.S. In hiring I never asked about a GPA or saw one on a resume. The interview was the thing!
Well Ms. 3.6 you really started something here the other day. Very creative I might add. Tune in closely to my next post! *Pops open a cool brew*
Will be tuned in! *Unscrews Diet Dr Pepper* Mix of alcohol and babykeeping possibly not ideal. Baby down for nap #2 of day. Hooray! *Shuffles off to read rest of newspaper* (or possibly pay bills? Ah…newspaper first).
The “Jessa Aside” certainly has gone viral on WUW. Dang useful thing! I hereby nominate it for inclusion in the Great Catalogue of Rhetorical Devices.
Wynette, you’ve reminded me of my one contribution to the practice of librarianship: The recipe for “Dr Merlot”:
One part Diet Dr Pepper
One part cheap merlot (doesn’t work with expensive stuff)
Serve on the rocks
It quite caught on with my colleagues– Librarianship’s version of The Dude’s White Russian!
And be careful, man, there’s a beverage here.
Wynette, my youngest was a surprise package, as in, “I’m sorry, what did you say, Doctor?…Really?…What the–?…How did THAT happen?…I’m sorry, there must be some mistake…Really?…Oh, hell, hold on tight, here we go again!” Completely get the nixing the alcohol/babykeeping while on duty when so young and the “Hooray!” My little man is about to turn six, but I still look forward to the post-bedtime cuppa. *Raising a glass of wine in toast to you and others like you who are putting in a second round* God bless you all!
Thank you for the good word, Elizabeth. Yes, my alcohol consumption saved strictly for after Aubrey safely gone home with her Mama. Congratulations on YOUR surprise baby! Aubrey was a bit of a surprise too for her parents who have an eleven and twelve year old already! Speaking of which (about the alcohol) *segueing*, I have to give a thumbs up to Joe’s Dr. Merlot! Eager to try new recipes, I searched in my frig and found—yes, Gallo Merlot and you know I already had the diet Dr. Pepper. It was the work of a minute to combine the 2 & chunk in the ice. Not bad! At first I thought “cough syrup”—-but on the next sip I thought “chocolate cherry cordial!” and I have enjoyed every sip. Pretty high on the “get bit quick” scale—-so don’t drink and then operate heavy machinery. Thanks, Joe! *Smiling*. And thanks again, Elizabeth, for the encouraging words!
“Red Scare”
Big Red soda (not available in some states).
Vodka to taste.
I once put my GPA down from undergrad. I had a 2.8 but I forgot to specify that it was out of a possible 3.0. I wonder how many potential employers didn’t bother to ask for clarification!
I just went through the hiring process, reviewing 40 resumes and cover letters. I don’t remember any GPAs. I barely remember where the applicants went to school. For me, none of that is as important as what is said in the letter/resume and the tone of it all. Call me nuts but even with e-mailed cover letters I seem to get a “vibe” off some and I tend to follow that gut reaction. If I had to choose between someone with some good experience and a 4.0 GPA with none, everything else being equal I would take the lower GPA with experience. Most of the time. It all depends on the interaction during the interview. I’m afraid what gets a person to the point of an interview is back to that tone and vibe from the contents of the cover letter and resume.
And when I get to the interview, I don’t do question and answer; I try to initiate a conversation about experience, attitude, hopes and dreams, why the person is interested in BIPL, what they like to do; and do they have pets (this answer is important to me). Naturally I have some specific information I want to elicit but I just hate Q&A. I have questiona and the applicant has answers; the applicant has questions and I have answers; all of that should come out in a nice cordial conversation.
Sorry to run on. I am always late to the comments and have to catch up.
(Irrelevant aside: how do you get the little comments beside the individual icons?)
“(Irrelevant aside: how do you get the little comments beside the individual icons?)”
It’s a Gravatar thing, I think. I seem to have generated one when I set up my WordPress account, and then promptly forgot how I did it; but apparently you can establish a gravatar independently:
http://en.gravatar.com/
Ack, I don’t have any pets – my two kids seem to be enough work for me. I may need to go back on the job market soon. Should I get a pet? Does a fish count?
Never heard of the need to put a GPA on a library resume, but my accountant friend said that it’s par for the course in his field to put GPAs on theirs. Maybe its a love for numbers?
Personally, my GPA has gone up the more interesting my classes were:
2.7 in high school
3.4 in community college
3.76 as an undergrad at UCLA
and I actually don’t remember my GPA from library school even though it was the most recent. I know I got mostly As and a B or two, but really…It’s grad school, you get a degree whether you get all As or all Cs. Unless you’re trying to get into a doctoral program, grades matter not at all.
I’ve never had to hire anyone in the library field (just barely got hired myself), but I’m sure GPA won’t make a hint of difference. I’d actually be surprised to see it on a resume. Upon seeing it, I would promptly ignore it.
Phew, haven’t commented here in a while. Nice to stretch my commenting muscles again.
And nice to hear from you again.
Welcome back, Oleg. You’ve been missed.
Oleg! *hugg’d*
I have been on hiring committees and very rarely seen a GPA on anybody’s resume, degreed librarian or paraprofessional. We look at previous experience more than education, as a barometer of how well we think the applicant would fit in with our staff and community.
I would recommend against any newly minted librarian to put the GPA on the resume. Most employers will require official transcripts, where they will see the GPA anyway.
I have never been asked to answer that question or asked that question in an interview. If someone volunteered their gpa I don’t think I would look on that as a “selling point”. Too little is reflected by a gpa…I would be much more interested in many other aspects of a perspecive employee’s education!
Though I was a straight-A student for most of my academic career, I agree re: not putting your GPA on your resume. I do want to comment on the “GPA is meaningless” thread though. I don’t think it’s meaningless, but it isn’t always clear what it means. Did the person get straight A’s because s/he is brilliant and/or committed to excellence? Or did the person take nothing but easy classes to avoid jeopardizing the GPA? Or focus on grades instead of learning and living life? Did the person earn a high GPA while holding down a full-time job and raising a family? A GPA is merely one data point, meaningless when considered on its own, separate from the rest of a person’s education, experience, and personality.
How about the flip side? What does a low GPA tell you? Especially with grade inflation so widespread, it seems like a low GPA would hurt more than a high GPA would help — if anyone bothered to check.